03
Jun
2007
14 Comments
Unsurprising
I don’t think there is any question that the Israeli Secret Service, whether the Mossad or Shin Bet, are the dirtiest scoundrels of any intelligence services the world over. Their attempts to subvert opponents know no bounds, including Israeli lives.
New British report claims Israeli Shin Bet colluded with PFLP behind the Entebbe hijackings so as to prevent rapprochement between PLO and US and to sour PLO’s standing in France.
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Does anyone here have an opinion as to whether the Lebanese Army was right in trying to arrest Fatah al Islam members in Nahr al Bared? Who is right in this conflict?
sorry- i just don’t believe it-
The army is right!
Limpia, I don’t understand. What is it you don’t believe?
Limpia you are right – I also just don’t believe it!
Yes Patrick – you hear a very unproved rumour that the government took the claim that Israel also may have aided the hijackers & that so “Israel hijack role ‘was queried “ -
then you take it as proved, according to your may already suspicions & conspirations theories you already had before what they ‘do’ & ‘might do’
Just this last sentence shows, that his contact man, that even the PFLP works together with Israel or is even a helpless tool in the hands of Israelian complots – some people also say that Israel is responsible for the fight between Hamas & Fatah, is responsible why any person can’t sleep at night in the whole wide Islamic word. – Maybe it’s also Israel who makes Hamas shoot Quasams into Israel – Why? – maybe the the film rights for that story – maybe to be told in the news all the time? – maybe because they sell that Quasams? -
Well there are people who believe in any s..t!
I wonder who this DH Colvon’s anonymous contact person is? (let’s spread just another bad rumour) , – does someone here really believe that Israel secret service & PFLP (People’s Front for the Liberation of Palestine) work together? – in politics you can also easily find contact men who tell you that a Jewish worldwide conspiration group had blown up the World Trade Center on 9/11 -
but just this news where a ‘may’ about Israels role in this hijacking is mentioned, then you get at once absoluty confirmed that the evil Mossad & Shin Beit did it – probably according to your prejudices you already had before.
No – I don’t believe a word & what is not surprising to you – is surprisingly enough to believe for me indeed!
This isn’t coming from some 9/11 conspiracy theorist or some Arab propaganda portal, this is coming from the British government and a well-informed member of the Foreign Service who clearly has experience with Entebbe. Why would the British lie? What would they have to gain from this?Who has anything to gain from this? There’s no underlying reason why anyone would lie about this.
Besides Israel has done this before, playing a careful game of sabotage and deceit.
Does Operation Rosemary/Lavon Affair ring any bells?
USS Liberty?
The foreknowledge of the US Marine barracks bombings in Beirut?
The kidnapping of Mordechai Vanunu?
Israel freely conspires with its enemies to bring down another enemies all the time. Look at Israeli Marc Rich and how he violated US law to sell weapons to Islamist Iran. Some people even suggest Israel aided Islamic fundamentalists in MB and Hamas to provide a counterweight to Israel’s secular enemies in Nasser and the ARab Nationalists and the secular PLO.
Having a blackmailed or bribed informant in a group like PFLP is hardly the same as controlling it.
In any case, all assertions about what any secret organizations do are a necessarily inventions. By definition if they are secret there is no way to know what is actually going on. Information about OSS (predecessor of the CIA) actions during World War II are just now becoming public 60 years later.
Put more bluntly, if the Mossad or Shin Bet did any of those things, would they tell you about it? So you don’t really know anything about it, do you?
Some people even suggest it was all done by little green men from Planet Oberon. The use of such a phrase means you have no facts at all, doesn’t it?
With today’s level of technology and other teams of “secret” services – you’d be surprised as to what kinds of things can be exposed.
this is not a official British statement – bbc just tells about a note from a French diplomat – & some of his sources saying that – so even this bbc-report is just metioning it, but not saying that it’s right or wrong – someone says, that someone said, that he heard by another (anonymouse) source – it’s a question – a query, not a statement – so don’t tell anything as truth, before it’s proven!
- maybe any secret service is doing sometimes strange things – just like it’s strange that people shoot at each other – what they really do & what is suspected what they did & are doing is sometimes closer together & sometimes only an invention of suspection – in this case I believe it’s only a given rumour – bbc was very carefull to give it not as fact, than , that it was something they heard -
I know that Mossad was inolved in a plot against Nasser time ago – secret services are another face of warfare – but I don’t believe that Israel is masochist enough to make it’s own people martyrs, for their goals to survive – that’s more the way of Hamas etc. -
yes that is exactly what I was telling – some people suggest anything about Israel because of course Israel is the supposed devil to all the region & they have claws & horns of course..
you always will find ‘some people’ for anything (in any nation of the world) ..
Esra’a, no matter what technology you and I can buy at Fry’s or wherever, I suspect people with nearly unlimited budgets and all day every day to work on this stuff have ways to pry into other people’s business and to keep their own secret that we can’t imagine.
Leaks happen but because of counter-intelligence and the abundance of conspiracy theorists there is never a way to tell what is actually a leak and what is just online venting of prejudices and paranoia.
I think the closest we can come to knowing what might be going on, not what is, is by interest analysis. One can figure what such and such a country’s operatives might be doing if we know, or think we know what they think is in their national interest. But without supporting information, even that is mainly blind groping.
In the United States, for instance, it is widely supposed that much of our military intelligence activity is driven not by foreign concerns but by inter-service rivalry. Nobody knows this for sure because absolutely no one in a position of authority would ever admit it.
But there was an analogous situation a few years ago in which a general with the Army Corps of Engineers publicly announced that a particular construction project in Mississippi should be funded because it would be good for the Corps of Engineers (i.e. rather than good for the people of Mississippi). Congress promptly ripped him a new one, if you catch my meaning, and he was forced to retire.
In a flood control project one can see how even an experienced officer could lose sight of the standard BS. In a military situation, I doubt that sort of mistake ever happens.
Esra’a, on the same subject is the background history of the Hubble Space Telescope. As the story goes, during the 1980′s as part of the Strategic Defense Initiative (Star Wars) scientists working for the Defense Department were working on ground based laser weapons that could shoot down incomig missiles while they were still in outer space. They figured out a way to use computers to undo the twinkling effect of the inherent turbulence of the atmosphere (which is why stars appear to twinkle instead of being motionless as they are when seen from outside the atmosphere.) This was of course top secret.
In the meantime, NASA had developed a project to launch a telescope into orbit, the Hubble Telescope, to be able to do astronomical observations outside the atmosphere. That means that Defense watched silently while NASA spent over a billion taxpayer dollars on a completely unnecessary project that was obsolete before it was launched.
When the de-twinkling technology was declassified it was incorporated into UC’s Keck telescope on Mauna Kea in Hawaii in the 1990′s. The ESO uses an alogous technology and baseline interferometry for an even more successful result. Which means that is so declassified that it has been released to foreign governments.
Going back to interest analysis one can only speculate that the weaponry use of the technology turned out to be a dead end and they declassified it because it was no longer of any value to them. Even so, one has to also assume they knew for a fact that the Russians also knew it was a dead end and that there was nothing to keep secret. Which of course means that we had spies in the Russian missile development program. What a surprise
But all that is surmise and inference. Not a word of it is fact.
Really?Do you include North Korea’s secret services?The Russians?The Chinese?Several other unsavory nations?
No, I don’t think that either the Mossad or Shin Bet are “clean”- no secret agency is, if only because the fact there is very little public overview and power like that tends to corrupt, and the Israeli ones are probably fare from the cleanest around, but I doubt they are *that* dirty.
Anton, I suppose the way to find out for sure would be to go to each of their offices and ask them.
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