How are ethnic minorities and immigrants dealt with in your countries?
This is the new question posed to us by the German paper which we’re collaborating with:
In Germany a big conference takes place at the moment between the government and a variety of immigrant organisations. They are to discuss the problem of how the integration of immigrants in Germany can be made more effective and successful. The “National Integration Plan” includes for example compulsory German language courses, arrangements against the forming of “immigrant ghettos” and regulations on forced or arranged marriages.
How are ethnic minorities and immigrants dealt with in your countries? What kind of minorities exist, which status do they have in society and how do you experience their presence? Do you think it is right to say that all inhabitants of a country have to speak the main language, even if they have foreign roots? Maybe you have an opinion on how Germany deals with its immigrants or even relatives or friends, who live here. Share your view on immigration, integration and the treatment of ethnic minorities
Please note: Your comments in this thread will be translated and published here.
Previous articles they featured from us:
Mein erster Kuss (My first kiss)
Wir sind keine Hippies (We are not hippies)
Looking forward to read your answers!
Join the Conversation
I think this is a good opportunity to bring the case of migrant workers in the Gulf to attention. They barely have any rights, and their treatment is what I would call “slavery.” In fact we think their case is serious enough for us to run a campaign: Migrants Rights in the Middle East
Migrant workers in the Gulf are basically people who come to our countries seeking employment opportunities, most of them are from South Asia and come due to extreme poverty. They work as farmers, housemaids, garage and construction workers, shop keepers, and the amount of labor work they are expected and forced to do is unbearable. Many get paid less than $100 a month – some don’t get paid at all!
We think our laws aren’t good enough to protect them, and their human rights are hardly ever enforced or even acknowledged, even though they do most of the harsh labor work. Without them construction companies wouldn’t function. They are grossly underpaid, yet work constantly while companies and people take advantage of them and treat them like 2nd class citizens.
In my view it contributes to racism, because we treat Western workers in the opposite manner, giving them all the benefits and security they wish for. Foreign investors are very well taken care of, while South Asian workers are humiliated within our societies.
I do believe that migrants and minorities SHOULD speak the main language of the country in which they live!
Why? So if a minority who is native to that country and don’t speak what the majority speaks then you gona mess around with them?
Hi Esra’a I agree with you about working minorities, it’s the same in Kuwait.
As for me, I lived in Syria for a few years and as some of you already know I do not approve of the Kurdish suffocation. The Kurds in Syria were deprived of basic civil rights for a very long time and I believe the same is true for Turkey. The other thing is that in the Middle East a lot of the time we have people separating us by religion not just by ethnicity. You will see Arab Jews categorized as a different race, even if we are the same, we have the same history and culture it’s just religion. It’s hard to really define a minority.
Should minorities be fully assimilated? Well I don’t think by force, certainly not, in fact in countries that have big immigration rates the economy is usually better, the multiculturalism gives us a sense of plurality. A few years ago I went to Berlin to be a student for 6 months, I shared an apartment with a Russian immigrant, he told me a lot about this case. He said he doesn’t mind learning the language just as long as it doesn’t completely replace his own language and culture. If an immigrant goes to another country and fully assimilates that is changing your identity just to fit in with another group, and I don’t like that. My family moved a lot and it was because we faced poverty during the 80s. It was too much pressure to learn the languages and cultures of all these languages, we wanted to be ourselves and practice our own identity but fully respecting the cultures of our host country. There is nothing wrong with doing that in my opinion. If you try to replace the religion, the language, then yes that should be not allowed but if you are just respecting their language and culture and trying to follow the rules as best as you can while still keeping your own identity, what is the problem? Multiculturalism is a beautiful thing, we should embrace it.
Like Bahrain we also have a growing Persian community. Sunnis who were persecuted in Iran many years ago came to the Gulf. We have a Shi’a minority as a result of that. To be honest it just makes the country a tad more interesting! In my opinion it would be very boring if we all talked the same and practiced the same beliefs. Let there be difference, and let’s learn how to share for once.
Well, in The Islamic Republic of Iran (IRI) basically we don’t have immigration even IRI government deeply has been trying to get rid of most of Iranian’s opposition
But we do have lots of refugees from Afghanistan since the Afghanistan- USSR war and Al qaeda oppersion. as I recall, refugee is a type of immigration, not likely but it’s. so IRI had an organization to manage refgues. I should say IRI didn’t support them that much and mostly they were in poverty.
They are mostly unskilled and in entry-level physical labour jobs. They involve in small factory works, building, construction and farms. they get very low-rate hourly wage, unbelievable! even sometimes they don’t get paid because they don’t have right to work. Their cdocuments expiers very fast (I can’t recall how fast)
Unfortunately, some of them are saling drugs and they do crimes which it comes from poverty but IRI law is harsh for everybody in Iran. An incident in past 2 years, 2 Afghanis, raped and some children and molested some other which based on IRI law, they get killed. in some of IRI provinces they do sex-trade. They do marry to Iranian girls then after marriage they sell their bride to brothels in Afghanistan. it’s sad.
Even IRI denied to get basic services such as medical insurance, primary education right, working right which altogether put lots of pressure on them to leave IRI. It’s official IRI policy that all the remaining almost one million Afghan refugees in Iran should go home asap.
The most gross thing is how people in IRI interact with Afghanis. it’s full of racism. They rob them, blackmail them and bully them! I am sick of this behaviour.
Honesty I found out people in middle east are so racist to neighbours. Arabs, Iranians, Turks, Kurds, Afghanis and etc. we can’t even accept each other for a second, why? where is the humanity?
what’s wrong with us? On the flip side, people in the middle-east treat Western people in a very good manner which is good although it raises this question why don’t we treat Afghanis in same good manner? do we just prejudice? or what?! your comments could be much of help.
These refugees don’t have any peace in destination country and not only they can’t contribute in advancement of the destination country but also they live by the meomry of racism and hatred of destination country. Whole thing stinks and nothing good will come out if it.
Have you heard of the part of new york city called Queens? In this area there are abundance of immigrants from all over the world. it is absolutely incredible to see neighborhoods filled with pakistanis, indians, chinese, korean, south americans, latin americans, and many more. these individuals fill our city universities even if they are first generation, they work long hours and appear to abide by democratic, secular ideals as a rule, even if, for example, they oppose the war . They practice religion ornot and many run retail businesses such as restaurants(yum).I think that there is fostered a feeling with this city of’live and let live’ despite any bias of any particular individual. Incidents of bias are reported , and if satisfaction is not received via the law, individuals realize they may then attempt to employ the media. Also, however, women may not be abused, married off against their will. People cannot have servants that they abuse/ mistreat. I have heard of saudis in our area who have taken their servants(indonesian) to new york and continued to not pay them, mistreat them and take their passports. These employers have gone to jail in New york and elsewhere in our country. I have heard of mosques in queens where they have complained that they are under surveillance that is undeserved, yet I think that this is bound to happen because in our situation it is possible there will need to be t surveillance of various groups to ensure the safety of all. Checks and balances seem to work overall and I suspect immigrant groups would agree, as witnessed by the desire they have to come here.
In addition, I should say yes. I think all inhabitants of a country have to speak the main language, even if they have foreign roots because immigrants should have part of a new society and involve in society which speaking is a basic element of the interaction between immigran and new country.
I knew that immigrants in Australia and Canada (mostly Canada) instead of being involve in new country they make a colony in the new country. for example, chinese just deal with chinese! even most of the times they don’t need to speak English! so other ethnics too.
It seems to me so called, Multiculturalism are just multi-colony society and defensive one. just imagine Vancouver a city of colonies! people with same ethnic origin deal with themselves! what’s the problem? how can we solve it?
I think so knowing that, what are your expecting, what do you want to do, where you came from, how different the cultures are, your support systems and so on can pinpoint some factors which play major role in an immigrant destination in new country. also immigrant flexibility is very important.
But I think so the major fundamental problem is trust and being trustworthy. who else can you trust? and problem will be solved if just everbody decide to trust and be a trustworthy.
keep it in mind that we need new people for new country not just inside of new country.
Fariborz you wrote,
This may be true, but I wonder how Western countries would deal with the huge amount of war refugees that the Middle East has had to deal with. Iran has the largest number of war refugees. Now Syria, Jordan, Egypt are getting millions of Iraqi war refugees, Egypt has two or three million Sudanese refugees.
What you have left out is the role the Untied States has played in creating this war refugee problem, The U.S. had recruited and trained Muslim extremists to fight its proxy war in Afghanistan against the Russians, When the Russians were defeated, this made the Untied States the number one superpower in the world. In the meanwhile, Afghanistan had been left in ruins and millions had died.
Currently, the United States is committing genocide in Iraq in the name of democracy. It uses agent provocateurs to fuel the violence so they can have an excuse to stay in Iraq until they have found a way to take control of the oil wealth. Pro-war people say they are got rid of the brutal dictator Saddam Hussein, what they leave out is that the United States had helped bring Saddam Hussein into power and supported him, strategically and financially, when he was committing his wortst atrocites.
The United States supplies weapons to the rebels of Darfur. The weapons they supply are not enough to subdue the Sudanese government, only enough to create chaos and perpetuate the violence.
Fariborz (Iran),
Immigrants from all over the world live together. Immigrants usually interact with other immigrants. For example, I lived in an immigrant suburb. Most of my friends are from the Philippines, China, Jamaica, Pakistan, India, Bangladesh and I am from Sri Lanka. We the second generation of sort speak English with one another, only speak our first language at home.
People who come here work 8-12 hour shifts, maybe 14, they simply don’t have time to learn a new language fluently. They will speak broken English with you and can understand the language. Being homeless and being fluent in English is not an option for most, they have a family to raise and mouths to feed.
Think before you say anything.
The government of Canada offers free English and French classes for those who wants to learn the language, that’s what my mom did. That’s what almost every one of my friend’s stay at home moms did, or they had to do, the government nag you to death till you either goto school or work, they offer school for free. The government here knows how to make a functioning multicultural society.
RandallJones, stop bringing US into this. This post is about how much of a racist society the Middle East as a whole is. They expect Westerners to treat them with dignity, but they treat the migrant workers who do labour related job and the minorities in their country like animals. Hypocrisy at it’s best. Compared to how Americans treat Arabs, what they do is many many many times worse.
I’m from the US and now Israel, so I’ll stick with Israel for this discussion.
Israel is a crazy unique bizarre society of immigrants and natives (religions, ethnicities, nationalities), and the categories all blend. Most of the population is people who are immigrants, from first, second or third generation. Their countries of origin range from across the Middle East (Arab, Persian, Turkish), Europe, Former Soviet Union, English-speaking countries, Ethiopia, South Africa, etc. As well, within Israel are 1 million native Arabs.
It depends on who you are, where you came from, as to how you are treated in social situations. It’s a very very complicated country as far as demographics. People speak at least 2 languages for the most part. Hebrew and Arabic are official languages but Russian and English are also extremely common. There are parts of the country where you won’t hear Hebrew or Arabic. You can get by with English in most places (I’m not just speaking about tourism).
I could write a thesis on the topic, and in fact, it’s been done before over and over again. You get that with a complicated society.
If I need to go deeper, let me know. This is one majorly overfilled can of worms.
To Jina:
Excuse me?!!
1. Did I write people should speak fluently? But I insist all immigrants should speak main language of the new country because immigrants will become citizens of a new country and as a citizen they have responsibility to the new country. If they don’t know how to communicate with the main language of the new country, they can’t be a good citizen. They would be passive citizens.
Immigrants are free to talk at home in their own native language as long as it isn’t a problem to their child education in new country.
2. Having friends from other countries in the new country is not news but I wrote about dealing! People from different origins prefer to deal with their origins in the new country so far! It’s unfortunate true. For example, Chinese mostly deal with Chinese. Africans prefer to deal with Africans.
Even sometimes they want to live close to each other and the make select a territory to reside there then they call it for example, “China Town”, “Little Italy” or if you have been in Toronto you know where you can find most Sri Lankian people, Scarborough or Mississauga?! even which territory Sri Lankian gangs are working? How many Sri Lankian gangs are out there? What category of products do they provide?! These kind of information are all available because there have been lots of studies about immigrants.
3. Immigrants have rights but we should know there are some responsibilities that come with those rights. A good immigrant is an active immigrants who’s involve in society. For example Canadian citizens responsibilities are:
3.1. understand and obey Canada’s laws;
3.2. express opinions freely while respecting the rights and freedoms of others; and
3.3. help others in the community;
3.4. care for and protect our heritage and environment;
3.5. eliminate discrimination and injustice.
3.6. vote in elections( municipal, provincial and federal)
3.7. support Canada’s ideals in building the country
An immigrant who doesn’t know the new country language, he simply won’t understand his rights and responsibilities! so he wouldn’t make a good citizen!
4.
Do you know in English this statement is considered rude?
If you disagree with my opinion, just say it. (FYI) you shouldn’t give people advice before they ask you because it considers rude.
5. You could disagree with me about immigrant colonies and how they make their own little country in the new country but studies are out there. just look for it specially there are many studies about Canadian immigrants out there.
Fariborz Shamshiri
To Eliesheva:
I would like to know about there more. In fact I got thid DVD for Israel tourism ministry (I guess) to watch before travel over there. could you write why did you call it complicated society? please write more about your personal opinion about everything, daily life, freedom of speech, human rights, tourism and so on
I know it’s a lot!
To RandallJones:
Irrelavant question, please stick to topic
Comment:
I am not sure any country in the world can make chaos like what you do in this community
Explain to me what this passive citizen is? From what I understand, almost the entire nation can be classified as such. And you have a funny definition of being a good citizen. Being a good citizen means obeying the law and paying your freaking taxes, not speaking a specific language.
Canada is a multicultural country. People can speak whatever the language they want whenever and where ever they want, if you have a problem with this, then stay in Iran and piss on the minorities there, don’t come here. Ever heard of the term freedom?
Now go tell this exact same thing to those who were born here…
In term of voting, you do know that the turnout in immigrant municipalities is high compared to the rest of Canada right? And I really really don’t have time to correct all your mistakes here so I’ll advice you to go do some research before you write things.
You are also having hard time with the concept of freedom. As long as you are not breaking any law, the immigrants can do whatever the hell they want. If you have problem with this concept, stay in Iran, don’t come to any of the Western countries. Feel free to abuse the minorities and immigrants in your own country, don’t bring your crap to mine.
And you say I am rude? Read your own fucking comment and it’s more than just rude.
Funny how you want people to assimilate, but point this part out. Canada’s identity is as a multicultural nation. This is our identity, equality and diversity is our ideals. This is what our government spend so much money on to preserve and here you are saying something foolish things to get rid of it. Ones again, learn about the country you live in, because you are the immigrant who is not following the countries ideals… you are the one that needs to adopt to what this country standards.
BTW, why are you bringing in irrelevent information about, gangs and crime etc…
To Jina:
Firs thing first, why are you angry? what’s wrong that can’t you keep a peaceful discussion?
Discussion is a consideration of a subject by a group in an earnest conversation.
So please keep discussion in a good mood! being rude and making it personal doesn’t help. I think it’s better to discuss with an open-minded attitude to the subject.
An active citizen understands the benefits and the honor and the obligations of living in a democracy. These people know that they can have an immediate effect on their local community, nation or international.
The Passive Citizen is the person who watches what goes on in politics – in international affairs but does not believe that he or she can have an effect – this person feels helpless. These citizens might vote – or might not – since they often believe that it won’t really make a difference anyway.
What you write about good citizen is consider Apathetic Citizen or Passive Citizen. it depends on some other factors on our example citizen! But based on what you wrote in older posts I guess you are talking about Apathetic Citizen.
Did I write that people have no right to speak whatever language?
Of course they have right to speak whatever language they want but not everywhere! A canadian citizen should speak English or French! Immigrants can’t pass citizenship exam with their native language! this is an obligation to anybody who wants to be Canadian citizen! e.g. An immigrant in government positions should speak only and only English or French not whatever language he/she wants!!!
First, I wrote you in my older posts that this statement consider rude because I didn’t ask for your advice!
Second, why do take things personally?
Third, do you suggest to act against human rights declaration?
Four, do you know in the canadian court of law, I can sue you because what you suggested here?
Average citizens has a simple definition of freedom which it doesn’t apply to current societies in the planet, if you have basic law information I would be happy to discuss about Freedom with you.
If you think so you do have enough information and really you would like to discuss about it, I prefer to write a post about freedom and then we discuss there. Just let me know.
Everyone can be Apathetic or passive citizen whether born in the country or not!
In the term of voting You are wrong!
Did you really take a look at statistics then start to argue with me? or just what?
Just Québec population is about 673,105 which 11,075 of it is total visible minority population, so how on the earth immigrants turnout could be more than Canadian?
Even, if you just check “Few immigrants, non-whites vote in city elections: Report” Toronto Star, October 13, 2006 it says:
“If you are an immigrant and also happen to be non-white, chances are high that you didn’t vote in the 2003 municipal elections
The report shows that in Toronto, where a disappointing 38 per cent of voters turned up at the polls in 2003, immigrants and visible minorities voted in significantly lower numbers than white Canadian-born residents � regardless of their socio-economic status. ”
And if you studied The Roots of Immigrant Participation in Canada then yo uwould know:
“It is widely held that voter turnout among immigrants is lower than among the Canadian-born electorate however The data reveal show that rates of voter participation are higher among foreign-born than Canadian-born members of visible minorities.”
And most interesting fact is, nearly one in five Canadians is foreign-born so for you assumption you would considered most Canadian-born people very Apathetic citizens who don’t bother themselves to vote which is not ture and your assumption is wrong
People born outside of Canada had lots of problem even to find where to vote!!! (their english/french sucks, sense of direction and reading maps. of course some of them)
In “Explaining the Turnout Decline in Canadian Federal Elections: A New Survey of Non-voters” report we have:
18 percent of non-voters born outside Canada were more likely to report not knowing where or when to vote. Also 18 percent of non-voters born outside Canada were more likely to say that being on the list.
Are you accusing me of abusing people in my country?
I am telling that you have no knowledge about Canadian law, you know based on Canadian law, I can sue you just for accusing me for something that I have never ever done?! do you want to try it?
If you believe you’re right! you should provide exact phrase instead of addressing whole comment.
I have no personal problem with anybody (it seems some people have) so I am not impolite to anybody!
If your english language was good enough you wouldn’t find any problem with Canadian multiculturalism and diversity with support Canada’s ideals in building the country.
You know what’s funny? You were furious for you own irrationality (no offence, just I don’t think so it was rational) to the maximum which you forgot what we were discussing at all!
If you check above posts, you would remember I was talking about dealing! Mostly people from different origins prefer to deal with their origins in the new country! even Gangs for example Sri Lankian, they reside in specific areas and they deal with some specific minorities!
Mostly people from same origin mostly try to reside in same territory even Gangs from same origin try to be active in that territory!
These information available in Toronto Police. just go ask
I am confident in all information that I have provided. if there is a mistake, highlight it and please don’t take it personally! then you can’t keep good discussion and you would try to fight! which I don’t see any reason why can’t we keep a good discussion? huh?