Keep trying.

all this arguments between voice of islam and voice of christianity , and where in both religion have plenty of things to point out , but hinduism which has suffered most at the hands of islam , what it has done to suffer at its hands , nothing , and no arguments holds, as the koran clearely prescribes what is in store for kafirs like me , but alas nations sleeps while civilasation weeps

A Hindu commenting about suffering?

Buddy, take a look at what your Hindu fanatics have been doing in India for decades! Torching a 15th century mosque, killing innocent Muslims in Gujrat, beating Indian Christian pastors, burning an Australian missionary alive after dragging him out of the Jeep in Orissa, torching movie sets that offend Hindu sensitivities (Deepa Mehta’s Water ring a bell?), and the bigotry from Hindutva/RSS/BJP jackasses, yeah that’s part of the fine peacefulness that Hindus hold.

There’s one arguement that these Hindu fanatics cannot answer, and that is how Hindus suffered at the “hands of Islam” when India has more Hindus than Muslims.

It’s ironic that a Hindu dares to comment about suffering, when they have no problem inflicting suffering on others, especially Christians.

Hindu fundos should keep a leash on themselves before commenting on others.

Sub-human may not have been the right word, but lets just say they are not the kind of people you would want over for tea!

Muhammad’s revelation created a division in the status quo at the time and he made many, many enemies who did not accept his faith. He was engaged in battle after battle with these people and my suggestion was that much of the war talk was used to rally his followers to fight the pagans. AND…these same references used against them is being taken out of context for purposes of terror today.

I have no qualm over what Muhammad had to do during his day. It could be argued that the people during his day were some of the most backward on the Planet. Frankly, it is amazing simply from a historical point of view what he was able to do to the peninsula in such a short time.

Could it be that all the huge references to war were simply meant for the sub human people that Muhammad whipped into shape, molding them and forcing them to another level of existence?

WHAT??????

But, common sense and real world wisdom point to other conclusions. As you so thoroughly pointed out, yes the Quran does make such references and yes, there appear to be a more proportionate amount that other religions.

My own take is above any attempt to blanket Islam as a religion of war.

You leave out completely references to the context Islam came about and to whom it was revealed–war mongering pagans in the middle of the desert. Could it be that all the huge references to war were simply meant for the sub human people that Muhammad whipped into shape, molding them and forcing them to another level of existence?

I think everyone is aware, or at least should be, that indeed, Muslims have to make a choice. Revert back to barbaric times, or apply what makes sense and what the World needs from them. I think a majority of Muslims do indeed realize what to take literally, figuratively, and allegorically. It is not for us to tell them “this is what your religion says”.

Reason #1:

Islam is unique among religions in having a developed doctrine, theology, and legal system mandating warfare against unbelievers. This is found in the Qur’an and Sunnah, as well as in Islamic jurisprudence. Many like to point to violent passages in the Bible as an alleged equivalent to this, but actually the Bible contains no open-ended, universal command for believers to wage war against unbelievers, as does the Qur’an (9:5, 9:29, 2:190-193, etc.).

(my bolding) The foregoing passage can be found here.

Reason #2: Muhammad said,

Whoever changes his Islamic religion, then kill him.

That bit of gentleness from Muhammad can be found here in the most canonical of hadith collections, Bukhari.

Reason #3:

Islamic texts encourage terror and fighting to a far larger degree than the original texts of other religions, concludes [Danish linguist] Tina Magaard. She has a PhD in Textual Analysis and Intercultural Communication from the Sorbonne in Paris, and has spent three years on a research project comparing the original texts of ten religions. “The texts in Islam distinguish themselves from the texts of other religions by encouraging violence and aggression against people with other religious beliefs to a larger degree. There are also straightforward calls for terror. This has long been a taboo in the research into Islam, but it is a fact that we need to deal with,” says Tina Magaard. Moreover, there are hundreds of calls in the Koran for fighting against people of other faiths. “If it is correct that many Muslims view the Koran as the literal words of God, which cannot be interpreted or rephrased, then we have a problem. It is indisputable that the texts encourage terror and violence…” says Tina Magaard.

The foregoing passage can be found here.

Reason #4: Since 9/11/01, thousands have died in Islamic terror attacks all over the globe. See here.

Reason #5: But perhaps the biggest reason many people focus worried scrutiny toward Islam is that it commands Muslims to use all kinds of means – such as persuasion (which would include voting), deception, terror, war, and demographic jihad (immigration and reproduction) — to spread the rule of Islamic law all over the globe, and to subordinate non-Muslims to the status of debased, second-class citizens. See Qur’an, Chapter 9, verse 29:

Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Messenger [Muhammad] have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book [Jews and Christians], until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.

In response to concerns about efforts to impose Islamic law around the world, and of late particularly in Europe (see While Europe Slept, by Bruce Bawer) some respond that when Spain was dominated by Islam, it was a multicultural paradise for Christians and Jews. But even Maria Rosa Menocal, as Spencer points out

…in her extended whitewash of Muslim Spain called The Ornament of the World, admits that the laws of dhimmitude were very much in force in Al-Andalus [Muslim Spain]:

The dhimmi, as these covenanted peoples were called, were granted religious freedom, not forced to convert to Islam. They could continue to be Jews and Christians, and, as it turned out, they could share in much of Muslim social and economic life. In return for this freedom of religious conscience the Peoples of the Book (pagans had no such privilege) were required to pay a special tax — no Muslims paid taxes — and to observe a number of restrictive regulations: Christians and Jews were prohibited from attempting to proselytize Muslims, from building new places of worship, from displaying crosses or ringing bells. In sum, they were forbidden most public displays of their religious rituals.

About Muslim Spain, Andrew Bostom and Bat Ye’or write:

…Iberia (Spain) was conquered in 710-716 AD by Arab tribes…Most churches were converted into mosques…it proceeded as a classical jihad with massive pillages, enslavement, deportations and killings.

Toledo, which had first submitted to the Arabs in 711 or 712, revolted in 713. The town was punished by pillage and all the notables had their throats cut. In 730, the Cerdagne (in Septimania, near Barcelona) was ravaged and a bishop burned alive. In the regions under stable Islamic control, Jews and Christians were tolerated as dhimmis – like elsewhere in other Islamic lands – and could not build new churches or synagogues nor restore the old ones. Segregated in special quarters, they had to wear discriminatory clothing. Subjected to heavy taxes, the Christian peasantry formed a servile class attached to the Arab domains…

(…)

The humiliating status imposed on the dhimmis [Christians and Jews under Islamic law] and the confiscation of their land provoked many revolts, punished by massacres, as in Toledo (761, 784-86, 797). After another Toledan revolt in 806, seven hundred inhabitants were executed. Insurrections erupted in Saragossa from 781 to 881, Cordova (805), Merida (805-813, 828 and the following year, and later in 868), and yet again in Toledo (811-819); the insurgents were crucified, as prescribed in Qur’an 5:33*.

The revolt in Cordova of 818 was crushed by three days of massacres and pillage, with 300 notables crucified and 20 000 families expelled…

…Thousands of people were deported to slavery in Andalusia [Muslim Spain], where the caliph kept a militia of tens of thousands of Christian slaves brought from all parts of Christian Europe (the Saqaliba), and a harem filled with captured Christian women. Society was sharply divided along ethnic and religious lines, with the Arab tribes at the top of the hierarchy, followed by the Berbers who were never recognized as equals, despite their Islamization; lower in the scale came the mullawadun converts and, at the very bottom, the dhimmi Christians and Jews.

(…)

In Granada, the Jewish viziers Samuel Ibn Naghrela and his son Joseph, who protected the Jewish community, were both assassinated between 1056 to 1066, followed by the annihilation of the Jewish population by the local Muslims. It is estimated that up to five thousand Jews perished in the pogrom by Muslims that accompanied the 1066 assassination…

(…)

The Muslim Berber Almohads in Spain and North Africa (1130-1232) wreaked enormous destruction on both the Jewish and Christian populations. This devastation — massacre, captivity, and forced conversion — was described by the Jewish chronicler Abraham Ibn Daud, and the poet Abraham Ibn Ezra…

…although Maimonides is frequently referred to as a paragon of Jewish achievement facilitated by the enlightened rule of Andalusia [Muslim Spain], his own words debunk this utopian view of the Islamic treatment of Jews: “..the Arabs have persecuted us severely, and passed baneful and discriminatory legislation against us…Never did a nation molest, degrade, debase, and hate us as much as they..”

Halim we have no problem allowing comments like yours. But sometimes you do seem to generalize and talk without any support or proof. Its very ignorant. In a college you would get an F.

I am not Muslim and I do not stand up for people who are fanatics. What I do is bring you back down to reality and show you your own prejudices and ignorance–which is actually very easy to do.

We only delete comments when there is direct and unequivocal defamation and slander at one, or ones religion.

If you make a claim–like the one you made

Jihad is at the core of Islamic ideology. Jihad and islam is one entity. Message of jihad is loud and clear in the letters of self style prophet of islam.

Back it up! Give us real World examples instead of letters that are 1200 years old.
Would you like me to find letters from the Pope during the crusade that says kill all Muslims?

Come to reality and come to the table and play with the big boys.