Muslims Against Sharia: Islamic reform movement
Author: Esra'a (Bahrain) - September 25, 2007
Recently, I came across this interesting suspicious project whose goals are the following:
⇒ To educate Muslims about dangers presented by Islamic religious texts and why Islam must be reformed
⇒ To educate non-Muslims about the differences between moderate Muslims and Islamists (a.k.a. Islamic Religious Fanatics, Radical Muslims, Muslim Fundamentalists, Islamic Extremists or Islamofascists)
⇒ To educate both Muslims and non-Muslims alike that Moderate Muslims are also targets of Islamic Terror
What do other Muslims think of this? Do you think it’s haram (forbidden) to openly want to reform the Qura’an and its teachings?
Here’s a list of verses that they want to either remove or change.
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On the homepage of the website it says under heading of the “need to reform” it says “Twenty-first century Muslims have two options: we can continue the barbaric policies of the seventh century perpetuated by Hassan al-Banna, Abdullah Azzam, Yassir Arafat, Ruhollah Khomeini, Osama bin Laden, Muslim Brotherhood, al-Qaeda, Hizballah, Hamas, Hizb-ut-Tahrir, etc., leading to a global war between Dar al-Islam (Islamic World) and Dar al-Harb (non-Islamic World), or we can reform Islam to keep our rich cultural heritage and to cleanse our religion from the reviled relics of the past.”
The fact the they include Yassir Arafat in the list shows that this organization is more concerned about promoting Zionism than in reforming Islam. Israel funded and allowed Hamas to flourish as a rival to the secular Arafat. Israel has a long history of fueling the violence amongst groups in Palestine, in order to make excuses to continue to oppress the Palestinians.
Why does the website leave out that Osama Ben Laden and other foreign Muslim extremists were recruited and trained by the United States to fight its proxy war against the Russians. The defeat of the Russians facilitated the collapse of the Soviet Union, making the United States the number one super power in the world. In the meanwhile, Afghanistan was left in ruins and millions of Afghans had been killed.
If you go to the websites blog, they make a comparison of the Iranian President Ahmadinejad to Hitler.
For some reason they leave out how the United States and Britain had toppled the democratically elected government of Iran, and put in power the Shah. Also, during the Iran-Iraq war the United States gave false intelligence and sold weapons to both sides of the conflict. Nobel peace prize winner Henry Kissinger had said about the war, he hoped they killed each other.
There is so much misinformation on that website I am surprised that you chose to put a link to it. This website is more concerned with demonizing Muslims than reforming Islam.
There’s something very suspicious about that site, and I’m determined to know the team behind it.
Why do you call this website “interesting”? These are just some angry kids pissed at anything Islamic. If they hate the current state of Islam and the Koran so much, why don’t they just convert?
Lovely diction.
If you believe that the Qur’an needs to be “reformed,” or changed, then you reject one of the basic beliefs in Islam, that the Qur’an is the direct and unaltered word of God. To me, this is no longer Islam.
I also think this project is stupid, not interesting.
They forgot “TERRORIZTS!”
They seem to be located in Omaha. I am wondering why a site like this is not available in Arabic, the language of the Qur’an. Are they American Muslims behind this, or what?
They speak highly of Ayaan Hirsi Ali too, “omg shez so brave.”
Anyways, I was just wondering if anyone else found this site ‘haram.’
Definitely not and they don’t even really see the irony behind this…
If any average person can change the Qur’an to what they WANT it to be, to the extent of actually changing or removing its words, then that’s exactly what terrorists are doing.
Esra’a, this is a better source and a credible writer to bolster Islamic reform.
That site is a joke. They sure do have a lot of stuff they want to take out!
Anybody who reads anything that is supposedly God given will realize that there are verses and then there are Verses.
Verses vs verses cascade over them and neutralize any harmful or outright idiocy one idiot could conceive or derive.
If you examine a blade of grass you will see many apparent discrepancies or inconsistencies, but if you look at the whole field, then it makes more sense and you can appreciate it more.
Hmm. I agree that their somewhat radical desire to reform the Qur’an itself makes them a bit of an oxymoron, since it’s not just hadith that they’re against - so, in that sense, they confuse me.
However, they did get one thing right: Sharia needs to be abolished. There’s clearly very little about it that actually comes ‘from God’, so to speak.
And I’m speaking as someone who has been forced to live under Sharia my whole life.
The homepage of the website, under the heading “The Crusades vs. The Inquisition,” it says
So if they think the Crusades was justified, why do they not think Jihad is justified?
Why they do not condemn how the United States, Israel and certain European countries have collaborated with Muslim extremists and have used agent provocateurs to fuel violence amongst and against Muslims and Arabs?
Sheema I agree with you that Sharia today is extremely difficult to live under, that’s why at first glance I thought that this group would be a breath of fresh air. Unfortunately their problems with Islam go much further, to the point where they are willing to re-arrange the whole religion to fit their needs. This is unacceptable.
A more accurate name for them would be “Muslims Against the Qur’an.”
First of all, congratulations on the new super cool design. I am LOVING LOVING LOVING it!!!
And now to this group. In my opinion, they are ignorant Muslims who don’t even understand their own religion. Calling for reforming the Quran itself is simply against the core teachings of Islam since we believe the Quran is the eternal and literal word of God. To call for reforming and changing that which God has said is unacceptable. The Sunnah and Ahadith on the other hand are questionable since they were compiled by men.
The Sharia is derived from 1) the Quran and 2) Ahadith and Sunnah. It’s not holy as it is simply the opinion of men who practiced ijtihad and derived their own interpretations from the two aforementioned sources.
To reform Sharia, one doesn’t need to change the Quran. One needs to reinterpret it based on the Quran as it is.
What this group is calling for is not theologically legitimate and hence will not be convincing to any significant numbers of Muslims. For reform to happen and be effective, it needs to come from valid theological points, not just some random mumbo jumbo.
Islamofascists. They actually used that cute term. I can’t be surprised. After all, they want to change the Quran itself.
I’m leaning towards thinking they’re just a Muslim bunch of sorry, self-hating ass kissers, but hey I can’t be sure. Who knows, maybe their intentions are good but they’re just misguided and naive in their actions.
To their defense, they want to change it because they think people in the past already did. They don’t trust the Koran so much, which like Yaman said, goes against the fundamental beliefs of Islam.
As for Sharia itself, ya it is pretty much screwed and in need of reform - theologically legitimate reform.
Very well said Drima.
Who here thinks they’re non-Muslim posers? Not that I’m a conspiracy theorist or anything, but I think that’s a legitimate doubt.
No they are Muslims, at least if they say so. Not real ones though. Sharia reformists are very different and many Muslims believe in it, it’s an easy fight to get involved in. But reforming the Koran is something completely different, and stupid/dangerous.
They’re just weird enough to be against any form of representation:
Along with praising the cartoonists for their “bravery” as opposed to condemning their sheer ignorance and inconsideration. Really, I’ve never come across Muslims this daft or self-hating.
The Qur’an states that adulterers should be lashed, non-Muslims must pay jizya and that the testimony for women is worth half that of men.
There are problematic verses in the Qur’an, but if Muslims profess that it’s the infallible word of God, and its message is universal, speaking of ’striking out’ verses is well…an oxymoron
[…] Muslims Against Sharia: Islamic reform movementRecently, I came across this interesting project whose goals are the following:. ⇒ To educate Muslims about dangers presented by Islamic religious texts and why Islam must be reformed. ⇒ To educate non-Muslims about the differences … […]
Some of these comments raise legitimacy to statements that anti-Semitism is an intricate part of the modern Islam. Has anyone ever bothered to find out how many Palestinian Muslims were killed by Jews and how many Palestinian Muslims were killed by Muslims since 1948? Jews and Christians are much better friends of Muslims than Muslims themselves. We must stop hating Christians and Jews, but first, we must stop hating ourselves.
Hey, we’re not the ones hating on the Qur’an, enough to insist on changing it. Why do you denounce ONLY Muslim crimes and ignore everything else, as if Islam is actually the source of the problems you “tackle”?
I really do doubt you guys are actually Muslims. Your views are just so biased it’s unbelievable. You don’t even try to be subtle in your agenda.
You don’t represent us or this faith at all.
Are you trying to be ironic or does it come naturally to you?
Here’s a thought: take your own advice.
That group has ties to that whore Pamela Geller of Atlas Shrugged.
Ali Eteraz: Misguided Muslim Reformists
That has more information and some links on the origins of this suspicious group.
I’m telling you they’re posers. They just can’t possibly be Muslim.
I agree that there are a number of aspects in the Quran that appear ‘negative’, shall we say, but no ‘real’ Muslim would even contemplate altering the Quran.
What I do think is neccessary however is for a more exhaustive investigation into the possible ‘meaning’/'interpretation’ of the Quran in terms of its historical context and its relationship with the future.
I beg to differ. While most conflicts do involve mutual offenses by both parties, especially long standing ones like the broader Christian Muslim conflict, there are conflicts which are entirely unprovoked and for which the blame can only be assigned to one party.
I believe the Muslim invasion of Iberia is such a case.
whatever and whoever they are i dont know-
however, their mentioning the clear separation of church and state as a reason to keep out the footbaths is valid.
LOL Esra’a, that’s EXACTLY what I was going to say. You are absolutely right - there doesn’t seem to be anything on their website that actually talks about reforming Sharia itself.
Maybe the problem with these people is that they’re labouring under the misguided belief that Sharia is derived wholesale from the Qur’an? Could it be that they have absolutely no idea of the actual process (and people) behind Sharia? Which would make them very, very misguided indeed. But a lot of believing Muslims are like that too.
Anyway, I tend to hold the (perhaps also somewhat extreme) view that Sharia, even reformed and liberal Sharia, is not really hugely necessary or even desirable at all. But that’s just me.
PARANOID,
Do you have anything to say about the many countries the United States has invaded, without provocation?
Sheema and Esra’a,
As I have said before, the website is more concerned with demonizing Muslims than reforming Islam. It’s a political, hateful, misleading website.
We have the concept that a jew can be an atheist and still be a jew- that atheist may still want the customs, the morals, the teachings, and he or she still has the heritage. is this possible in islam?
No - if you lose faith in God, you are no longer a Muslim. But I meet too many Muslims with doubts who still associate themselves fully with Islamic teachings, so the concept does exist. It’s just not “official.”
you all might be interested to hear my background- We were not taken to temple,((therefore, not ‘practicing in the strict sense) but most certainly were taught heritage, customs, and morals and behaviors- which we saw as being behaviors and beliefs that we hoped and thought all humanity would to practice such as ‘do unto other as u would have them do unto u, all men are created equally etc. These were teachings perhaps of religion, but perhaps thins that mankind may have realized even outside of religion, per se. If one did not 100% believe that a god as a creator was an easy thing to believe or see as a reality it was understood as reasonable stance. In other words, one could wonder why our universe exists , and settle upon a question mark. After all, does anyone have proof? yet , mankind must live in peace, and the parts of any religion that foster that idea, the teachings, that is, are good parts of religion. Heaven, hell, again , uncertain.
I have heard that a Rabbi can be an atheist. I don’t know how true it is though.
well, i find that to be probably not too common - tho i can see an agnostic rabbi, one who can discuss mankind and mankind’s place in the world, all the questions re his mortality as well as the world;s events and its goings on, in a larger sense emphasizing all sides of an issue - who can see these events in light of the teachings of the jewish people which we see as teachings and rules that govern all people. I dont think a rabbi would emphasize his questioning of god’s existence becaase the concept of ‘god’s laws’ may be viewed as humanity’s laws from the prospective of a modern, questioning and perhaps agnostic rabbi. My town’s rabbi may be agnostic and he is in awe re the world’s beauty and complexities, one might say, with jewish law and teachings used as a guide for understanding.
Please read this:
Exposing Muslims Against Sharia
http://exposingmuslimsagainstsharia.blogspot.com/
Much-needed and challenging blog, well done. I agree with your first post completely that it can’t possibly be a Muslim website.
To Muslims against Sharia: Let’s have a dialog
http://exposingmuslimsagainstsharia.blogspot.com/2007/09/tomuslims-against-sharia-lets-have.html
Wow, what a rude reaction to someone simply attempting to dialogue. I guess we can’t get responses from them if comments keep getting moderated and deleted at their own will. I guess it’s their loss, most people don’t believe or fall for their very weird website.
I feel that the biggest problem with Islam is not that it is based on out dated notions of right and wrong. But that it has never been based on truth. Real truth does not change nor does it depend on the eye of the beholder. Islam has now and will always use force because without it the world would soon turn its back on a fruitless faith. I hope that you understand that my boldness is not intended to anger anyone but the truth is that Islam is now and will always be a dead religion because it is founded on illogical thelogical reasoning.
wishing you allthe best