She burst into eternal blooms for freedom
I still can’t believe it. I saw her last night in the news, she looked all smiles and cheers, she looked ambitious, she decided to mother the land, despite all the controversies, she was back to make a change, what a brave woman she was, Mis. Benazir Bhuto. God bless her spirited soul.
We are in the neighboring Iran and we don’t know much about our neighbor, but I recall my great grandmother, who was so old and she couldn’t move out of the bed, she wore a veil when she watched tv, she believed the tv men would see her. She loved Bhuto and when Bhuto was on the news she would talk to her, invite her!
She was popular in the Middle East. When it comes to corruption charges, here in our beloved Middle East, one never knews they are for real, or they are the efforts of the opposing party to take over.
In all the sad news we hear about Pakistan, this beautiful country home to good people of Pakistan, it was an inspiring event to hear that Bhuto made her mind to go tend the untended, to help the ones who needed her intervention, and they were many.
It was dangerous and she was courageous. She stepped into the region realizing all the danger.
She ignored all the bombings, all the treats and all the bombs that would explode in front of her eyes. She made a desicion like a Woman. A woman when she decides she is doing some thing just and she wants to do it, oh man is there any one to stop her? no one dares.
Well we lost her this morning. She was injured and the injuries were too critical to give her more change of living.
In my mind and as I feel, in the minds of many people around us , she will be a flower, eternally blooming in the name of freedom.
G-d bless her soul and G-d help her family and her beloved nation and all the ones who feel for her, in their grief.
Pakistan, I want to live as to see you prosper, your rights reserved, your people liberated, peace preserved and a promising future for your people granted, Amen
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I just saw it in the news. What a horrific situation!
Here are some articles on the matter:
Benazir Bhutto shot dead at suicide bombing of rally; 20 feared dead
Bhutto, dead at 54
Bhutto murder ‘could spark civil war’
This last article scared me the most:
I really hope it’s not true, and that our friends in Pakistan stay safe.
Oh dear!!
Kind of funny considering it was she who was responsible or partly responsible for all this.
Esra’a
Assassination is a what cripples the region. I wish we could condemn assassinations in the region, for political or religious causes,I wish we could rally against assassination.
I hope people look into her efforts to lead a national party which could have helped Pakistan out of the present tensions…The person who shot her they say has exploded himself as well. Who nurtures the idea of killing? How would some one who does not feel for himself, feel for any one else? How and who justifies this act, in a way the assassin would do it and fade away, what would make him feel so strongly just, when he is merely wrong…this is not fair..
Jina,
Responsible for all what, she was responsible for her own decision to come back home and get the party going. She didn’t need to do that, she felt responsible.
She’s responsible for robbing the poor, that constitute vast majority of Pakistan, she’s responsible for funding and training the Taliban, she’s responsible for denegration of women’s right in South Asia, she’s responsible for Musharaf coming to power. She’s responsible for a lot of things. She got what she deserved.
She did…
Jina,
Can you tell me how she contributed to taliban being recruited? and the degeneration of women in Pakistan?
Do you support any other party that was a rival party?
No one deserves to be assassinated, here is where you and me go wrong. She doesn’t deserve that. In case you are right in her being corrupt and i am wrong in her being a positive figure, she would deserve not being elected by people. About being financially curropt, perhaps many authorities in the region when it comes to money go that wrong, as much as once I overheard people in iran saying: OK they want to rub us off our national wealth, let them, at least let then share it a bit with us as well!
The thing is when we talk about authorities here we don’t compare them to ( I don’t know which country has the best authorities) the best. We compare them to other people who have taken the same positions within their own realm.
I compare Bhuto to women here in Iran after the revolution. At the same time, I believe if she really was curropt she wouldn’t come back to Pakistan. How come she was popular. Jina if you are more exposed to the what is going on in Pakistan, would you tell me whom did you back to take the position instead of Musharraf? Is there some one reliable mighty enough to make a change? Could a single person make the change possible?
Any way, they way she was killed served as deafening slap across the face of democracy, I will never forget this woman and her composure.
Ohh god… do I even have to say this? For someone living Iran, you should know this.
She’s not only corrupt financially, she made lots of people disappear, including her own brother. Poor guy, he was actually one of those good guys, this bitch got to him. Ohh before you call him a terrorist, I would like to say that he was a freedom fighter.
Mazdoor Kissan, then again what do you expect from a Commie.
She came back to Pakistan to use “bringing democracy Pakistan” to come back to power again. She’s popular because you saw people lining up to see her, kind of like how Musharraf is popular. If you can tell me why Musharraf is popular, I’ll tell you why Bhutto is and most likely it would be for the same reason. This is South Asian politics, very strange thing really.
Now I don’t know what to say… I hope what you say is not right, because she was a brave woman , you know
Jina if you are from Pakistan you might judge her better. I am not sure if i was in Pakistan i would vote for her necessarily, but the fact that her opponents killed her like will make her a heroine.
I just can’t get her off my mind….
You are free to live in ignorance. Your choice.
I am not from Pakistan, just a neighboring country. A country where she was instrumental in sending in arms to a terrorist organization that fucked up the country, kind of how she did the same to Afghanistan when she she funded and trained the Taliban.
She wasn’t brave, she was an opportunist, she tried to use democracy to get into power… things sometime blow up in their face… quiet literally for this bitch.
I’m with Jina on this.
Elinor, you should realize that Iran went to war against the Taliban and would have invaded if it wasn’t for Pakistan’s support of the Taliban (also didn’t help that they recently acquired nuclear weapons at the time as well).
Do some research on the woman before jumping to some stupid bandwagon.
Assassinations are good for posterity. Even Al Jazeera reported her death with the adulatory tone intact, disregarding their own reports on Bhutto’s less shining side. Reminded me of the ongoing Hariri adventures. Rafik Hariri went from ultimate fat cat to poster-martyr in minutes. Saad still sports the sad little I-inherited-power-from-my-democratic-dad look.
The comparison might not be 100% relevant, but I’m that worried. Liberal love is liable to drown the Bhutto legacy in a deluge of sugar-coated rose-colored glasses.
Interesting comparison William Dalrymple compared Pakistan to pre-revolutionary Iran a few months back. Bhutto gets called a friend of feudalism.
Thank you Tasnim,
Elinor, here read this.
Jina, Danial, Tsnim,
I follow the news and i see her pretty face and the way Pakistani people wave at her, and the way people wear t-shirt with her picture on it, then suddenly i find out she is dead. Not that every thing she did was right, maybe any one who steps into the position of power shares the original sin of being tempted by power.
I did not know her more than what I saw on TV every now and then, and for a long period she was out of the picture.
I can’t believe she was involved in training Taliban. Perhaps USA had been involved as well, to compete with USSR in Afganistan.
I have an idea that if any one is going to be blamed we all should be blamed as well. If the authorities are bad, then we are bad because we choose them, or we tolerate them, or we just don’t react well enough to make a difference. Then if we are all bad ( at least a little), then why should I pin point you or you accuse some one else?
If Ahmadinejad in my country is saying things that I do not approve of as an Iranina, when i don’t react publicly for any reason ( fear, censurship ), then it is me accepting him, right?
I was telling some one else about Iran’s old bathrooms , they called them Khazaneh, with pools of hot water and places were you get a good massage. The places were rather dark and my superstitious forefathers thought the place was full of ginies, they makde many stories about the ginese inside the public bathing places. They used to say gines looked like us, the only difference was that they had hooves instead of feet.
SO a man goes to the bathroom and it is almost empty, he is scared but he tries to overcome his fear and keep washing up. He sees another gentleman and feels safe, but looks at his feet and yes he finds hooves instead. He is scared and quickly goes to the neighboring sloon and finds a bunch of guys so he feels better comes close to the group and says” Oh , there were ginies there after my life, I know they were ginies because they had hooves” then guys show their feet and say, you mean like these ? ”
Any way my point is that we are surrounded by people who have hooves and perhaps we have hooves ourselves as well. So better we stop screaming and start doing some thing that we ginies are capable of doing!
The foremost would be making these cheap people who talk with bullets talk like real men , like real women.
Binezir here becomes a victim, and to me she is dear, perhaps all what you said was right, but dear friends, its been long time that I have become used to the fact that any one i admire turns out to be some thing i would have dispised if I knew what was really going on.
I need men men enough and women women enough to help this Middle East be liberated from the chains of violence.
I hope all what you say about Bhutto is wrong. I hope she goes straight to heaven.
I’m trying to find info on this - CNN made it seem like Al Qaida and the Taliban were so against her, and that she was the enemy of all extremist elements in the region.
Can you guys link up to her connection with the Taliban?
Not the best link ever but looks like Jina is right:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benazir_Bhutto
Oh my.
Human Rights Watch
Pleas eget your dates right … Bhutto was in power uintil 1996, only months after the Taliban came to power so stop spreading these lies and misinformation. But anyway, I think people can see the kind of hatred that existed against her that flourishes in these talkbacks … you can’t stop hate. Let the hatred come out to expose the haters, I say.
PS Elinor, I think we both began writing at the same moment when hearing of Bhutto’s murder as our posts seem to have appeared within minutes of each other. I had not seen yours when I started writing mine.
Ray Hanania
Most of the support the Taliban received was from the Pakistani government after Bhutto left power. And everyone knows that the Mujahidin that ousted the Soviets from Afghanistan and established their base in parts of Afghanistan and Pakistan got support from EVERYONE, until their evil purposes became apparent in the years AFTER they took power. Musharraf’s secret services work closelyw ith the Taliban today and many people believe that Musharraf is balancing both the fanatics and his supporters in a game to keep the Americans at bay. And President Bush is not very bright so he figures let’s keep Pakistan on the edge so we can keep our focus on Iraq. The last thing Bush wanted was for Pakistan to explode like this. He wanted the coziness to continue so he can pursue his money-driven agenda in Iraq for Cheney and the American Taliban Conservative Republicans
Ray Hanania
Esra’a
Hi dear, I am reading about her involvement in Taliban and the charges of corruption… thank you for the links.
Perhaps I felt very emotional, because she was a woman, and she was brave, and from the moment she entered Pakistan I was concerned about her safety. It was like her entering a trap and she knew it. It is not that cool to view the world from the opening of the media.
I cannot justify all what I read, here is where our leaders fall down, before any thing else; ” corruption”.
Some times I feel so jealous of Africa, particularly south Africa, because they have Mandela and we don’t. He is not corrupt, now plz don;t tell me he is corrupt too, he is not corrupt, and he forgave every one after he came to poer after years of being in Prison. This way a situation arised where Back and white could live together, this time productively.
I guess We need to import Mandelas from Africa, or, in case we want to go on with our terrorism, we can kidnap a mandela and bring him to the region. That might help.
Wow… so the Taliban materialized out of thin air the moment Bhutto left office… hmmm… you do know that it was during her reign that this fiend pumped up the Taliban for their eventual ascension…
Ray
It means we are both Middle Eastern, very emotional, very passionate
Ray I liked the woman but my friends here make me aware of the things that i didn’t know…
About Taliban I know they weren’t this way initially. It’s been some years that we don’t have pizza huts here in iran, but we have many differnt pizzerias, pizza here, pizza there, pizza pizza every where ( to compensate for that perhaps). So every now and then when a pizzeria opens we know for some time we will have the best pizza, then by expeience we know after two months we are fools if we buy from the same place any more. I guess parties and movements and freedom movements and revolutions, reforms and the like all share this malady with the pizzerias in Iran. By the way, there is a pizzeria close by which has good pizzas after two years, at least relatively, by my guest Ray
Jina don’t tell me you are not sorry for the lady, because you are, no one deserves to be killed like that.
Tell that to the millions of people whom she played god. And no, I don’t feel sorry for her, she should have been skinned alive instead.
oy, that is painful Jina, I don’t feel that even a shushi deserves that treatment.
Elinor, let me tell you about the difference between Middle East and South Asia.
In the MidEast, the dictator robe people of their future because they are dictators and that is what they do.
In South Asia, where almost all the nations are democracies, the leader robe people of their future in the name of democracy.
If you speak against a dictator in the Middle East, you are going to prison, like our friend Kareem, because they have laws that forbids speaking against the dictator.
In South Asia, if you speak against the democratically elected leaders of ours, you don’t goto prison, you disappear. This was the case when few of my uncles went missing, latest one was only last year. Or when my father’s friends went missing. Thank god my dad had a rich brother who smuggled him out of that hellhole we lived in. If he didn’t have a rich brother, my father’s fate would have been the same as all those who came before him and defied these democratically elected leaders.
Don’t believe everything you see or hear. If you do, you are nothing but a zombie. Kind of like how your government want you to be when it comes to dealing the internal policies of your nation.
Jina,
I am happy you are alright and your father is sound and safe, G-d saved him for you. I hope one day you get a good news of your uncle being alive and around.
I do tend to believe in what I hear because I rarely believe that people lie. I think they say what they believe, doesn’t matter how deviated it might seem from the truth i conceive.
This reminds me of a Korosawa movie, which revolved around a triology of truth.
A person had been killed and three people were the eye witnesses of the the event, so the movie treis to picture each individuals account, which differed from the other dramatically, and each of them blamed the crime on some one else, and finally we don’t know what really happened.
You take care of yourself Jina
“Pleas eget your dates right … Bhutto was in power uintil 1996, only months after the Taliban came to power so stop spreading these lies and misinformation. But anyway, I think people can see the kind of hatred that existed against her that flourishes in these talkbacks … you can’t stop hate. Let the hatred come out to expose the haters, I say.”
Uh no, the Taliban came to power in 1994, so it wasn’t just “months” as you eloquently describe it.
She was a corrupt politician who had lots of dirt in her hands.
Let me say first of all that I knew that if I wanted to get right into the controversy surrounding Bhutto unmediated by our media, this was the place to do it. Thanks, guys.
I had much the same reaction as Elinor when my friend told me of her assasination and we turned on the television: horror, not just of the deaths (Jina, I have to disagree with you there, no one deserves to die in my book) but of the way that the CNN coverage at 4pm today turned immediately to the US presidential candidates and how each of them was already trying to use this event to their advantage. Most despicable was Rudy Giuliani, who wasted no time in linking Bhutto’s assasination to the “War on Terror” i.e. the “War on people who we don’t like, especially if they are Muslim” and, of course, 9/11.
On the one hand, it’s heartening to see the extent to which foreign policy seems to be on the table (though I’m not positive how many of the candidates could identify Pakistan on a map). But come on, folks. After reading some of the postings herein, it’s clear that Bhutto’s specific agendas or actions were less important to the US than how her image could be manipulated.
Thank you for the links, Esra’a, it’s always good to be reminded to always dig a bit deeper…
While I do not really feel sorry for her (and I’m with Jina on this), I must add that I do not think anyone has the right to express opposition or disagreement by silencing rivals and sending them to the grave. I’d much rather have corrupt officials like Bhutto and others battle their way to power than be assassinated by those who are also guilty of playing God, by claiming the lives of others.
So just because they don’t like Bhutto, they kill another 20 innocent lives and wound more than 50? Are these lives so worthless and insignificant that the assassination of one person justifies the loss of all the rest?
I don’t think the people of Pakistan need democracy or any different political system. They need education. And they’re not alone; this also applies to the entire Middle East. People should learn that to prove yourself right, you don’t need to eliminate opposition. Being the only option available just doesn’t make you the best. It just makes you the best dictator.
Another one bites the dust for the sake of “freedom”.. And more bloodshed will flood down the streets of Pakistan.. Horray humanity..
*does a military salute*
God rest your Soul BB.. For all the intentions you had for that country..
You know what pisses me off? is people who blogged the hell out of the internet picking on her corpse saying who’s to blame and who’s to be next, and how corruption fills the air of Pakistanti politics.. And then try to scheme how Musharraf wanted this to happen.. Then I think when the news brings that the US might decide to invade Pakistan to stop the nuclear power from being in the militants hands, and then the eruption of another semi-iraq war “with a shiny new purpose” would make people ask a good question..
Didn’t this happen before?
UGH.. damn politi’puppets..
Miriam,
When I wrote this I was crying so bad, I couldn’t believe that this woman who was campagning few hours back suddenly get killed, this is not fair, I didn’t know about all friends here expressed about her previous office terms and her being corrupt or not being corrupt. I mean corruption could not be the effect of one peorson’s activities, in a well defined system a corrupt person will fall and the system will remain.
Miriam what bother’s me is that I cannot have a clear vision if I don’t want to blame some one in particular for all what happens. Perhaps people of name and fame should be analyzed dimension by dimension. In one dimension the person is nice, responsible, and promising and regarding the other dimension, she is not what people need, they are done with her, she hadn’t been successful in taking care of the state of affairs. But the way she ended up was so tragic….I can’t even blame it on Musharraf, you know why, because a third party could assassinate and let it be blamed on him. I mean i am confused now, our region has too many problems, I just want, like the rest of us, that equity be practiced, people who feel more respnsible and affective take the posotions of power, specially the ones who believe in making the region peaceful, instead of waging wars and spreading agression. Needs of people being considered, long term and short term needs simultaneously.
I am not sure if elections in USA is exactly what makes me worried here, I hope people in USA and people in Kenya both choose the person who might help them more with their country affairs. I hope people in Pakistan as well pull themselves together and don’t let the tragedies discourage them as they get ready to vote for what they believe is the best. I hope the peace talks in Jeruslam be fruitful for both people, Israelis and Palestinians and I hope , likewise, stories of terror and problems don’t take that courage away, we all need peace and happiness in the region, we surely deserve it.
As to us Iranians, I guess a couple of years from now we should vote, last time I didn’t , like the time before, we listened to the ones who said don’t vote! if you vote you are helping the ones who are abusing power, see I didn’t vote and now what i get is really far from what i wanted. Perhaps I should have flet more responsible, perhaps i should have throught ” This is what I get in my country, agreeable or non-agreeable, I should vote at least to send the one into office, that sounds more like my reflections and my needs”.
We cannot change the structure, or the hierarchy of power overnight, overnight things go more wrong, and no one can guarantee what happens in long term.
People choose sides if she deserves this or not, but forget the bigger picture.. What about the pakistani’s then?
She even admits the support of the Taliban:
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/world/story/23841.html
I agree with her.. has a comfortable feel here
She was in power TWICE. first time in the 1988… the time when Taliban/Mujahideeen were at the highest point in their gloating [defeated the “Mighty” Red Army.. after all, then offered to defend Saudi Arabia from Iraq (1990)]
US gave all kinda arms n weaponry to fight the Red Army they technically flooded the region with it to get rid of Commies… lots of the Stingers n the weapons tht r being used against US Miltary came from it itself. [There was a fire in one of the Weapons depot in Rawalpindi in June - Aug 1988 where stinger’s without the warheads were going off like firecrackers..]
TOTALLY
She came to Pak ONLY after she was given amnesty and ALL corruption charges were dropped…the case against her in Spain was ‘cancelled’ n the swiss case is still ‘open’..
When someone gets a shot of their own medicine.. its not fair to say THIS.. there were no outcries when there were murders authorized by her .. the victims were not high-profile cash-skimmin western-backed puppets but ppl who would die for something resulting in a better n unified Pakistan ..
the only thing I feel sad is for the 22 or so innocent lives lost
LOOL the poor n innocent Kissan whose life will still stay the same inspite of the world whirpooling arnd him
ENVY HIM
Have to Say… share ALOT of view w/ Jina. [Ppl who have experienced this amazingly unpredictble n diverse country understand better. or just do ur research, read from BOTH SIDES]
now we have to sit back n watch the US candidates express sympathy for somtheing they dont even give a shit abt
reminds me tht BOTH bhutto’s were killed when Military Dictators were in power hmm thts brings more shame to a respected line of work [exception in Pak]
like Elinor I was a bit shocked when I heard of the assasination of Bhuto - in fact I didn’t know that much about her, but only that she was in opposition to Musharaf, the head of a military controled country supressing the chaos of rising fanatic religious & nationalist movements - it was spread that Bhuto meant a way to more democracy - but on the other hand I doubted for any chance for a real (not corrupt & failing) democracy in a country where the extreme powers of both sides are that strong - see the chaos that broke out in Iraq after a cruel dictatorshop ended - people weren’t ripe for democracy yet - the weakness & fall of the one is the rise of a lot of all the supressed powers sleeping there, waiting for their chance, struggling for power & control - remember what happened in Germany in the 20ies of last century when the first democracy was built after the last ‘Kaiser’’s reign. - It lead by free choice & votes to that extreme dictator Hitler. - so would it be possible for a ‘weak’ starting democracy to survive in Pakistan? - I doubt it. - it’s a long way of education to free thought & selfdesicided life which could lead to a halfway sound kind of alway imperfect kind of democracy..
refering to the quote of Danial
I remember sitting in the 80ies in a pub here in Germany together with some Afghans (refugees), telling me about their resistance fight against the Russian communist dictatorship. - Freedom fighters against suppression - they got support by the Americans, by the West, by Pakistan probably also by Bhutto – hm & by me too of course - it seemed a good thing in that time to fight against that Russian regime in Afghanistan. - Some time later a friend gave me informations about a dangerious brew of strict Islamic fighters & movement in Afghanistan – the word Taliban wasn’t even known yet here around -
If Bhutto is guilty of having once supported the Talibans, so I am probably guilty too, for having had sympathy for Afghan freedom fighters in that time . - Times changed, 9/11 happened, Al Quaida got reality & Taliban fascism got known to the wide ignorant world. - So Bhutto later turned clearly against Taliban (& Al Quaida of course) – & her death was maybe something like leaving the Mafia – they’ll never forgive you, if you leave them & even turn against them..
Pre-1990, any help would have helped the Mujahideen against the tyrants from the Soviet Union. That is understandable, I would have supported them if I were old enough to know who they were.
Soviets started to withdraw from Afghanistan in 1987 and complete withdrawal in 1989.
Bhutto was in power form 88-90 and 93-96.
Bhutto’s help came after the collapse of the SU. We are not talking about the help she may have given the Mujahideen pre-1990. Taliban became prominent in 1996, the year she left office, all thanks to her help in pumping them up in the previous 2 or 3 years.
Elinor, wrote,
I understand why you say this and agree that it is self-centered of our news agencies immediately to worry, “How does this affect us?” But it does worry me, because I am American and people like Huckabee who have this to say about Pakistan are running for the top position in my country.
Never been to Pakistan. I am from Sri Lanka, was born only few months before the civil war took off. Spent my child hood counting bombs falling from the skies. It’s fun. You should try it, just don’t stand too close to the place where they fall.
Yeah may get a chance to experience tht if I make up my mind to get recruited.. thinking abt it…
your facts abt Pakistan are quite correct.. respect tht in u
they just got something flammable which they will use to spin n use to their own needs until this cools down.. then they go back to the same lame campaigns
lol… one of these days I’ll find a way to there…
I like to read a lot… when you read alot, you tend to learn stuff. Also I am not narrow minded about what I read, I don’t nitpick what I read and read something that I like, I read everything. Things I hate entertains me or I learn a lot about how you can brainwash people and things I like inspires me.
Miriam,
WHat I said was because democracy is already there in USA, people choose the one who would best meet their interest and no assassinations will suppress the process of elections. That is good, but I don’t think here in Middle East the same kind of democracy could be applicable right away, specially when there is chaos and terrorists take advantage of it.
I guess Turkey has a good state of affairs, Turkey and India. in Iran the candidates are selected by a board of religious bodies who would choose some 3 or 4 or 5 out of 2000 candidates ! and that is exactly according to their standards, and then people have to vote to choose between these 3 or 4, and that is very ridiculous when they call it a democracy.
Ok ladies and gentlemen : Muneeb, Lou, Danial, Heimo, Tasnim, Mira, Miriam, Jina
I guess we all agree on the fact that assassination is a cheap way of dealing with diversities, now we either believe in the politicians or we don’t, either we approve of the way our contries are run or we don’t…
now adays tht’s rare in young ppl… n tht is exactly the reason “the other” ppl who dont read just stick to the wrong side of the story… just because some1 they know are on tht side. they dont read so they keep on defending something they dont even know! Bunch of Puppets.. [tht’s why I hate getting into debates at social gatherings, the cant even quote a source except “Person X told me!” ]
Indeed but why did it had to be a sucide bomb? couldnt they just poison her or use a damn sniper ? Atleast the 22 lives would be saved.. [Assassination is an Occupational Hazard for Politicians. and they know it]
Most people already made up their mind the moment they see, hear or read about something or someone. Facts actually plays a very minor part in their decision. If people stop this idiotic behavior, our world will be a much better place to live.
PS: Only thing tragic about the whole incident is the others who died or got hurt in the bombing. Mourn them, not this villain.