May be that interpretation holds good when a bride wants to become independent or to marry another person. But here, for all rationale and common sense, it’s obvious that the poor 8 year old has been wronged, so it will only be an injustice if she’s demanded to pay. Somehow state will have to intervene and pay in such cases(its a good thing that there are donors and human right activists) for the time being and should try to make some rule that such injustices don’t recur.

Rulings concerned with divorce are quite complex, but generally if it’s the wife who seeks the divorce, she’s expected to return her dowry.

But indeed, it’s wonderful that she’s been rescued from that hell.

I think in Quran its said, that dowry given once must not be got back even if its a heap of gold. So why should an estranged wife be forced to repay it?? After all the ‘mahar’ is like maintenance funds in case marriage gets cancelled!

Thank God, that this girl got back her childhood!

Today, Nojoud and her eight year-old sister Hifa are able to go to school thanks to the financial donations and moral support of human right activists and donors.

“We have chosen a public school despite generous donations from many charities and donors to support Nojoud in going back to school and starting her new life,” said Shatha Nasser, Nojoud’s lawyer.

“We took into consideration that Nojoud comes from a very poor family, with miserable living conditions, and that putting her into an environment too different from her own might create a shock,” Nasser explained, when asked why Nojoud would not be going to a private school.

Firstly thank you for your comment.
Secondly, what I am saying is that although I agree that many (too many) predominantly Muslim countries are affected by this terrible and unacceptable problem, I don’t think it will be solved by attacking directly the laws of those countries. The root of the problem is not in Islam or its interpretations. Nicaragua is plagued by the same problem: a horrific 43.3% of girls are married before the age of 18. There are no Muslims in Nicaragua.
The solution of the problem is in first pumping money into those poorest country, develop a free and accessible education system at the same time, then we will be able to see results in laws being amended and laws being enforced.
Attacking directly the laws won’t help as they won’t be enforced. These countries are also in the top tier of the list of corrupted countries.
I was not referring to Saudi Arabia or Iran, which are not part of the 20 worst countries. I was referring to only the twenty worst countries,(from the worst down) i.e. Niger, Chad, BanglaDesh, Mali Guinea, Central African Rep., Nepal, Mozambique, Burkina Faso, India, Ethiopia, Liberia, Yemen, Cameroon, Eritrea, Malawi, Nicaragua, Nigeria and Zambia.
I believe the problems in Saudi Arabia and Iran are different from those in Yemen. For Saudi Arabia and Iran, yes, we can talk about change of laws and interpretations of Islam. In both cases, however, I believe the solution would go through empowerment of women. Until we get goverments ready to empower women, the problem won’t be solved. There has been recent progress in the Gulf states so we can hope the wind will bring this progress to Saudi Arabia, but it won’t happen over night. I still think the problems in those 20 worst countries can be addressed more urgently though.

I believe RAWA over you and evidently there weren’t enough Muslim extremists in Afghanistan which is why the U.S. had to recruit foreign fighters from all around the world.

RAWA [Revolutionary Association of Afghan Women] has pointed out that there were several democratic-minded groups the U.S. and other countries could have supported if they had wanted to drive out the Communists and help restore independence to Afghanistan. Why did these countries instead back the fundamentalist Mujaheddin? RAWA member Sajeda told Said lt magazine in August that pro-democracy groups would have refused to act as “puppets” for other countries, and would have made it difficult for those countries to “maintain their economic and political interests in Afghanistan.”

from
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Women/RevolAfghanWomen.html

path wrote, “I’ve heard the hundreds of thousands stuff but that’s just crap and not supportable by any means other than what you’d like to believe as it supports your opinion. Killing any noncombatant is a sad deal but overinflating casualties for political purpose is bs.”

That could be said about any statistics regarding any genocide, including the Holocaust.

path wrote, “There are many anti war American reporters that would like nothing less than to report something like illegal activity/chem weapons. This conflict is not exactly under reported.”

Much of the mainstream media (left and right) leaves out the close relationship between the U.S. before the wars. That Barry Lindo video I linked to was shown in Europe, but not in the Untied States.

path wrote, “What public hearing are you refering to?”

Did you watch the Barry Lindo video? This information appears after 16 minutes into the video.

Yup, Astan and supported the Muj initially. What pro democracy Afghan insurgents would you be talking about. There were none.

“killed hundreds of thousands of people”…I’ve heard the hundreds of thousands stuff but that’s just crap and not supportable by any means other than what you’d like to believe as it supports your opinion. Killing any noncombatant is a sad deal but overinflating casualties for political purpose is bs.

There are many anti war American reporters that would like nothing less than to report something like illegal activity/chem weapons. This conflict is not exactly under reported.

regarding the border conflict…I believe it was the border dispute and not conflict….She later said she had no Idea he was talking Invasion. I also have no problem with the war between Iraq/Iran…their choice, we didn’t instigate it and I’d have assisted the Iraqis with supplies too.
“There was a public hearing in the United States where this issue was discussed and it was said there would not be any U.S. involvement with this issue.”
What public hearing are you refering to?

I am not familiar with this story, but if you believe this sort of thing occurs only in Muslim countries, you are only fooling yourself. Do you propose to bomb the country to help improve human rights?

When you say Astan, are you referring to Afghanistan? This is where the United States chose to recruits and train Muslim extremists, instead of pro-democracy groups, in order to give the Soviet Union its “Vietnam?” Millions of Afghans were killed; the country’s infrastructure had been destroyed. The war facilitated the collapse of the Soviet Union, making the Untied States the number one superpower in the world. The U.S. did nothing to help reconstruct Afghanistan. But you rationalize the deaths of millions of men, women, and children.

When the United States has bombed the infrastructure of Iraq, killed hundreds of thousands of people, put a country through a sanctions where millions of people suffered, all because of a feud with former U.S. puppet Saddam Hussein, you make all sorts excuses. You fool no one with your sanctimonious hypocritical preaching.

You bring up Saudi Arabia. How come people who are so outraged with Saudi Arabia’s human rights violations have nothing to say about the trillions of dollars the Saudis invest in the United States? How come you have nothing to say about the fact that the United States makes billions of dollars selling weapons to the Saudis?

path wrote, “If the US were using chem weapons everyone and their Mama would know it. AQ/Mooky’s boys would have made videos by now and they’d be up on the net.”

On 9/11 a video of Palestinians cheering was shown and reported around the world. Israelis cheering on 9/11 was barely reported in any mainstream media outlets. So the amount of people knowing about an event is not proof of whether something is true or false.

path wrote, “’Sadam Hussein, had gotten the okay from the U.S. before invading Kuwait’…Totally false, the Ambasadorial level individual did not know how to respond to the question put to her by a member of the Iraqi Govt. She hemmed and hawed and reported home….The Iraqi’s took that as a Yes and invaded shortly thereafter.”

Here ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UeY05iS5iv0 ) is a documentary by Barry Lando, former 60 Minutes producer, who interviewed government officials, 16 minutes into the video it says when Saddam Hussein asked April Glaspy about Kuwait, she reassured Saddam Hussein. that the United States would not take any position regarding the border conflict with Kuwait. There was a public hearing in the United States where this issue was discussed and it was said there would not be any U.S. involvement with this issue.

One thing those countries have in common: they are poor and education is not widespread. This is the real problems. However, I do agree the the Muslim community and this very site have a role to play in spreading the education within the Muslim countries on that list.

That’s why the U.S. continues to commit war crimes against poor/weak countries; there are no real consequences for the decision makers.

path wrote, “Last I checked Saddam started this ball rolling by invading Kuwait, if that event had not happened we’d not be there today.”

Last time I checked the former U.S. puppet (Sadam Hussein, had gotten the okay from the U.S. before invading Kuwait.

path wrote, “We’ve convicted senior officers of poor oversight etc. but the circumstances do not warrant your argument, when you go to war people get killed and infrastructure destroyed. US forces do the best they can to limit collateral damage.”

It’s so easy to be understanding of the “poor oversight” when it is not happening where you live. The Iraqis are scapegoats for US foreign policy

Path wrote, “What chem weapons are you speaking of?”

This article discusses it. http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2005/nov/15/usa.iraq

*****************************************************
Let me get back to the topic at hand, before Esra’a scolds me.

We spent so much in this topic talking about religion, then Kawthar points out in one of her comments,

“From the reports I’ve read, the marriage contract Nojoud was made to sign stated that the marriage would only be consummated at the age of 18. However, her “husband” began applying pressure, and demanding his “wife”.
Her father felt compelled to acquiesce (I suppose the authorities wouldn’t have been of much help), as his eldest daughter was abducted, and forced to marry her abductor”

SO the marriage was too bee consummated at the age of 18. He had another daughter abducted and forced to marry. So what is clearly the problem is not a cultural difference between the West and the Muslim world but of poverty and lack of law enforcement.
These sort of situations are not unique to the Muslim world and occurs in many poverty-stricken regions. Poor countries can not afford to pay law enforcement workers well so there is a high level of corruption and low level of justice. Even Western countries are usually not able to do anything about their male citizens going to Third World countries and sexually and violently exploiting children and women. Many of these poor countries, even though they may have laws against sex slavery, allow it to occur because of the money the “sex tourists” bring into the county.

Path wrote, “It’s interesting as the US gets castigated for being too involved in foreign govts. and at the same time castigated for not doing enough to influence foreign govts.”

No, its gets castigated because it commits war crimes and no U.S. high level government official is put on trial for it. The United States demands sanctions against countries for the same (or worse) crimes that the U.S. government have committed.

Path wrote, “I believe our Govt. would love to see SA stop exporting wahabiism, allow more freedom to its people etc., but how do we accomplish that or support that?”

The U.S. was able to get the international community to place sanctions against Iran for its nuclear program because it would be a danger to Israel, yet the United States has not placed sanctions against Saudi Arabia for spreading wahabbism; and this is the country where most of the alleged 9/11 hijackers came from.

Path wrote, “I agree that the business links between SA and the US are strong. The US no longer stores military hardware for its own use in SA, that ended some years ago and the equipment SA buys is for their own use.”

We won’t know if that’s really true until the next war. Right now Saudi Arabia is very dependent on the U.S. for protection.

Path wrote, “All of the bad news about the US/Israel and pos news about their countries, Palestine/Palestinians etc. granted, most of their news is state controlled/censored but still the flip side of what you recount.”

I don’t doubt that. It’s only human nature to be biased against the other, but the matter of fact the Untied States/Israel has caused more deaths, destruction of infrastructure, fueling of violence, and forcefully meddling in politics in the Middle East than the other way around. In addition U.S/Israel media point of view is spread more to the rest of world than the point of view of the Middle East.

Path wrote to Esra’a “I wish the troops in Iraq could come home tomorrow and had never set foot in the country.”

DO you think any U.S. high level government officials should go on trial for any of the illegal actions they have done in Iraq? OR are the laws against killing and destroying infrastructure, or using chemical weapons against people not applicable to people outside of the United States?

I’m guessing that her dad signed paperwork for her since she was kid. If she was older, could she have refused?

From the reports I’ve read, the marriage contract Nojoud was made to sign stated that the marriage would only be consummated at the age of 18. However, her “husband” began applying pressure, and demanding his “wife”.

Her father felt compelled to acquiesce (I suppose the authorities wouldn’t have been of much help), as his eldest daughter was abducted, and forced to marry her abductor

Talking and blogging is a good thing for change but at some point one must actually do something. The world is full of talkers but there is a dearth of doers.

Actually, in our region, talking is doing. People die for their “talking” and “blogging.” They get tortured, arrested, sometimes even hanged. So don’t talk to me about having “no balls” to do something – people on this forum are risking their lives trying to circumvent censorship and making people aware of all kinds of oppression, and that’s more than what you can say. So, once again, spare us.

That’s nice that you are thinking about punishments for the man who married the 9 year old.

But if you are living in the West you should also be discussing the collective punishment that Western nations give to poor/weak countries, even when they are doing something write. LIke the United States did to Yemen.

“…when Yemen voted against a UN resolution authorizing United States to use force against Iraq in 1990, UN Ambassador Thomas Pickering walked over to the Yemeni ambassador and said, ‘That’s the most expensive No vote you ever cast.’ According to writer John Pilger, ‘Within three days, a U.S aid program to one of the world’s poorest countries was stopped. Yemen suddenly had problems with the World Bank and the IMF; and 800,000 Yemeni workers were expelled from Saudi Arabia.’

Source: http://www.fff.org/comment/com0309q.asp

SOURCE? WTF

Some anonymous people on an answers.yahoo question about dating?

It’s the forced marriage thing, too. I’m guessing that her dad signed paperwork for her since she was kid. If she was older, could she have refused?

What can the guy be charged with?