Comments on: Flogging of a Saudi Professor! http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/ Thinking Ahead Sat, 11 Feb 2012 20:46:46 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Aftab Masood http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19531 Aftab Masood Mon, 28 Sep 2009 08:15:49 +0000 http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19531 First of all I am from Quetta Balochistan not a saudi but i think That Saudi govt and people have to have their Choice to have sharia law and Surre it benifts Women too. Why dont The Amnistey or this all who are barking in this site go and look at the Bastareds ( Born without Wedluck ) in USA and UK where they rape their mother sisters and each minute in USA more then 10 Rape took place . Where more then 2.3 million people are in jails because of commisted crims like killing, where no respect for perants . I think it is big shame to even think to make our Families values so much useless like in the West. I love all my sisters in Saudi Arabia but Must watch www.youtube.com and search for Reverted american muslims women. they all will say we find Respect in islam and in The law of islam. Shame on you Stupid Iqnorant keep saying about Coffee shop . U are not judge or you didnt seen them in coffee shop. so stop barking First of all
I am from Quetta Balochistan not a saudi but i think That Saudi govt and people have to have their Choice to have sharia law and Surre it benifts Women too. Why dont The Amnistey or this all who are barking in this site go and look at the Bastareds ( Born without Wedluck ) in USA and UK where they rape their mother sisters and each minute in USA more then 10 Rape took place . Where more then 2.3 million people are in jails because of commisted crims like killing, where no respect for perants . I think it is big shame to even think to make our Families values so much useless like in the West.
I love all my sisters in Saudi Arabia but Must watch http://www.youtube.com and search for Reverted american muslims women. they all will say we find Respect in islam and in The law of islam.
Shame on you Stupid Iqnorant keep saying about Coffee shop . U are not judge or you didnt seen them in coffee shop. so stop barking

]]> By: cait http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19530 cait Mon, 24 Nov 2008 11:33:14 +0000 http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19530 That is so sad...it's disappointing that men and women can't even be seen in public in Saudi Arabia. I have a former roommate and a former boyfriend who both live in Saudi as American Christians, so, I hear some of the stories from their compound which are bad enough. But coffee? come on... That is so sad…it’s disappointing that men and women can’t even be seen in public in Saudi Arabia. I have a former roommate and a former boyfriend who both live in Saudi as American Christians, so, I hear some of the stories from their compound which are bad enough. But coffee? come on…

]]> By: eric/canada http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19529 eric/canada Thu, 22 May 2008 13:18:04 +0000 http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19529 Hmm, well first I think that we all can agree that beating and imprisoning someone on what is essentially suspicion of something (in this case fooling around with female students) is unjust and completely heavy handed. At the same time, there is some doubt about the absolute innocence of the activity. There are teachers out there who abuse their authority and status to have affairs, but what really needs to be addressed here is should this be a criminal issue, rather than a civil one. If there is a complaint from one of the students in question that said professor is using his position to get into other, more 'ahem' desirable positions, then he should be either disciplined or fired, since such behaviour is unethical. If he is married, news of this should be revealed to his wife so that she can take the appropriate steps and leave and bankrupt his cheating ass. However, I really fail to see how this is injurious to the public. Is there seriously some sort of concern that this fellow is providing an example to be followed? Finally, what if the guy just likes to have a coffee and a pastry while having a discussion with his students? Is he also seen in the company of male students? Whatever happened to the principle of "innocent until proven guilty" or "innocent until you acutally do something wrong"? Hmm, well first I think that we all can agree that beating and imprisoning someone on what is essentially suspicion of something (in this case fooling around with female students) is unjust and completely heavy handed. At the same time, there is some doubt about the absolute innocence of the activity. There are teachers out there who abuse their authority and status to have affairs, but what really needs to be addressed here is should this be a criminal issue, rather than a civil one.
If there is a complaint from one of the students in question that said professor is using his position to get into other, more ‘ahem’ desirable positions, then he should be either disciplined or fired, since such behaviour is unethical. If he is married, news of this should be revealed to his wife so that she can take the appropriate steps and leave and bankrupt his cheating ass. However, I really fail to see how this is injurious to the public. Is there seriously some sort of concern that this fellow is providing an example to be followed?
Finally, what if the guy just likes to have a coffee and a pastry while having a discussion with his students? Is he also seen in the company of male students? Whatever happened to the principle of “innocent until proven guilty” or “innocent until you acutally do something wrong”?

]]> By: Global Voices Online » Saudi Arabia: Flogging for Professor http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19528 Global Voices Online » Saudi Arabia: Flogging for Professor Mon, 19 May 2008 12:28:24 +0000 http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19528 [...] He is actually facing an eight month prison sentence and 150 lashes!” explains Saudi blogger Rasha. Posted by Amira Al Hussaini Share [...] [...] He is actually facing an eight month prison sentence and 150 lashes!” explains Saudi blogger Rasha. Posted by Amira Al Hussaini Share [...]

]]> By: Elephant http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19527 Elephant Fri, 16 May 2008 20:12:46 +0000 http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19527 <blockquote>When the punishment is disproportionate to the crime, then it implies that it is not justice you’re after, but something sinister, like political control, or intimidation through fear, etc.</blockquote> Thank you, that's a great insight. Is the female Psychology teacher also in legal trouble? What happened with "the Girl from Qatif"? Was her flogging carried out?

When the punishment is disproportionate to the crime, then it implies that it is not justice you’re after, but something sinister, like political control, or intimidation through fear, etc.

Thank you, that’s a great insight.

Is the female Psychology teacher also in legal trouble?

What happened with “the Girl from Qatif”? Was her flogging carried out?

]]> By: Nissim Dahan (Israel/USA) http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19526 Nissim Dahan (Israel/USA) Fri, 16 May 2008 18:55:09 +0000 http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19526 Rasha, if it's not in the Quran, then it's a matter of people making their own interpretations of how things should go. So in making such interpretations, they have a choice. They can interpret harshly, or they can interpret moderately. If they interpret harshly, they alienate the moderate majority and create an obstacle to progressive change. If they inerpret moderately, they will be in step with the moderate majority, and pave the way for progressive change. So if we're already going to make interpretations beyond the four corners of the Quran, why not interpret in a way that makes sense to most people, so as to increase your credibility in the eyes of the people? They will then take you more seriously. I would take it a step further. Even if something is written into the Quran, it should be intrepreted so as to take into account present realities. Something that made sense hundreds of years ago may no longer make sense today, and I don't thing it goes against God's will to interpret the laws in accordance with modern sensibilities. In fact, I would argue that interpreting in this manner is precisely what God, the Creator of a changing Universe, and therefore the Creator of the possibility of change, would have wanted. Rasha, if it’s not in the Quran, then it’s a matter of people making their own interpretations of how things should go. So in making such interpretations, they have a choice. They can interpret harshly, or they can interpret moderately. If they interpret harshly, they alienate the moderate majority and create an obstacle to progressive change. If they inerpret moderately, they will be in step with the moderate majority, and pave the way for progressive change.

So if we’re already going to make interpretations beyond the four corners of the Quran, why not interpret in a way that makes sense to most people, so as to increase your credibility in the eyes of the people? They will then take you more seriously.

I would take it a step further. Even if something is written into the Quran, it should be intrepreted so as to take into account present realities. Something that made sense hundreds of years ago may no longer make sense today, and I don’t thing it goes against God’s will to interpret the laws in accordance with modern sensibilities. In fact, I would argue that interpreting in this manner is precisely what God, the Creator of a changing Universe, and therefore the Creator of the possibility of change, would have wanted.

]]> By: Rasha (Saudi Arabia) http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19525 Rasha (Saudi Arabia) Fri, 16 May 2008 15:36:15 +0000 http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19525 I have two comments to make on both Rasheed and Nissim Dahan Rasheed, As you mentioned in your comment that the professor even if he is known for meeting female students in coffee shops, the University should have sent him warnings instead of this cruel sentence. But let me remind you that female students especially post graduates who have male supervising their research or thesis have to meet with their professors to discuss the research and since our Universities are segregated meaning female students can't meet their male instructors on University campus so they try meeting them in public places such as coffee shops.. It makes sense to me.. Women are not allowed to go to male University campus let alone the offices of their professors and you really can't discuss a thesis or research on the phone at least not all the time.. As for Nissim Dahan, As I mentioned in the post that you will not find this harsh punishment in the Quran. Khelwa was not mentioned in the Quran script. I have two comments to make on both Rasheed and Nissim Dahan
Rasheed,

As you mentioned in your comment that the professor even if he is known for meeting female students in coffee shops, the University should have sent him warnings instead of this cruel sentence.
But let me remind you that female students especially post graduates who have male supervising their research or thesis have to meet with their professors to discuss the research and since our Universities are segregated meaning female students can’t meet their male instructors on University campus so they try meeting them in public places such as coffee shops.. It makes sense to me..

Women are not allowed to go to male University campus let alone the offices of their professors and you really can’t discuss a thesis or research on the phone at least not all the time..

As for Nissim Dahan,
As I mentioned in the post that you will not find this harsh punishment in the Quran. Khelwa was not mentioned in the Quran script.

]]> By: Nissim Dahan (Israel/USA) http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19524 Nissim Dahan (Israel/USA) Fri, 16 May 2008 14:37:41 +0000 http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19524 A society has a right to deter unwanted behavior like adultery. But the means you use says something about the legitimacy of your intentions. If the punishment is too severe, as in this case, then it undermines whatever legitimacy you may have had. Implicit in any judicial system is the notion of fairness. When the punishment is disproportionate to the crime, then it implies that it is not justice you're after, but something sinister, like political control, or intimidation through fear, etc. The Bible contains all sort of heinous punishments of this sort. But Jews, for one, came to the conclusion that such punishments were out of step with what made sense. So they collectively "whited out" such passages, and virtually ignored them. Something similar has to happen in Saudi, so that a sense of fairness could be brought to the fore, which would pave the way to a coming to terms with modernity, even as respect is shown for the legacy of the past. A society has a right to deter unwanted behavior like adultery. But the means you use says something about the legitimacy of your intentions. If the punishment is too severe, as in this case, then it undermines whatever legitimacy you may have had.

Implicit in any judicial system is the notion of fairness. When the punishment is disproportionate to the crime, then it implies that it is not justice you’re after, but something sinister, like political control, or intimidation through fear, etc.

The Bible contains all sort of heinous punishments of this sort. But Jews, for one, came to the conclusion that such punishments were out of step with what made sense. So they collectively “whited out” such passages, and virtually ignored them. Something similar has to happen in Saudi, so that a sense of fairness could be brought to the fore, which would pave the way to a coming to terms with modernity, even as respect is shown for the legacy of the past.

]]> By: Rasheed http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19523 Rasheed Fri, 16 May 2008 07:25:02 +0000 http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19523 I think the real story is that the professor is alleged to have set up meetings outside the university with female students on more than one occasion in order to flirt with them. When I was still at Arab News in Jeddah, we did a story on him and found out that he had been trouble several times with the religious police for these meetings. I personally do not think he should be imprisoned or flogged, but his university should have warned him that if he continued meeting students in coffee shops he would be fired. Maybe that would have deterred him. I think the real story is that the professor is alleged to have set up meetings outside the university with female students on more than one occasion in order to flirt with them.
When I was still at Arab News in Jeddah, we did a story on him and found out that he had been trouble several times with the religious police for these meetings.
I personally do not think he should be imprisoned or flogged, but his university should have warned him that if he continued meeting students in coffee shops he would be fired. Maybe that would have deterred him.

]]> By: Tonto (USA) http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19522 Tonto (USA) Fri, 16 May 2008 04:51:35 +0000 http://www.mideastyouth.com/2008/05/15/flogging-of-a-saudi-professor/#comment-19522 This is not religion, it's CONTROL. Saudis are supposed to be robots or something right? Disgusting! And totally ridiculous. And they wonder why so many former muslims are going apostate. This is not religion, it’s CONTROL. Saudis are supposed to be robots or something right? Disgusting! And totally ridiculous. And they wonder why so many former muslims are going apostate.

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